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Language is primarily a tool for communication rather than thought (2024) [pdf]

61 pointsby netfortiusyesterday at 2:42 PM21 commentsview on HN

Comments

andaitoday at 6:04 AM

When I was a kid a friend asked me, "Hey, you speak three languages. Which one do you think in?"

I was bemused, and thought... "people think in words?"

Apparently people with ADHD or Autism can develop the inner voice later in life.

In my 20s, language colonized my brain. Took me years of meditation to get some peace and quiet back...

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bolangitoday at 8:11 AM

Not sure how well this dovetails with the research presented in the article, but Grinder and Bandler's work -- which they named Neuro Linguistic Programing (derived I understand from analyzing the brief therapy and hypnotherapy techniques of Milton Erickson) -- postulated that people have dominant modes of thought: visual, auditory, and kinesthetic. They correlated these modes with eye movements they observed in subjects when asked to recall certain events.

In my personal experience, my mind became much less busy as a result of several steps. One being abandoning the theory of mind -- in contrast to spiritual practices such as Zen and forms of Hinduism, where controlling the mind, preventing its misbehavior, or getting rid of it somehow is frequently described as a goal, the mind's activity being to blame for a loss of a person's ability to be present in the here and now.

As a teenager, I can remember trying to plan in advance what I will say to a person when faced with a situation of conflict, or maybe desire toward the opposite sex, doubting that language will reliably sprout from my feelings when facing a person, whose facial reactions (and my dependence on their good will) pulls me out of my mental emotional kinesthetic grounding.

As humans we use language, however, it seems possible to live in our experience. Some people who are alienated from their experience, or overwhelmed by others, seek refuge in language.

There is obviously a gap between research such as this, and how someone can make sense of their agency in life, finding their way forward when confronted with conflict, uncertainty, etc.

wobfantoday at 8:43 AM

I have no clue, have not read the PDF, and am naive and dumb on this topic. But my naive thought recently was how important language must be for our thought, or even be our thoughts, based on how well LLMs work. Needless to say I'm no expert on either topic. But my naive impression was, given that LLMs work on nothing more than words and predictors, the evidence that they almost feel like a real human makes me think that our thoughts are heavily influenced or even purely based on language and massively defined by it.

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krackerstoday at 3:10 AM

Doesn't hellen keller provide a counterexample? She seemed to imply pretty strongly that before acquisition of language she operated more on stimulus and bodily perception rather than higher-level thought.

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netfortiusyesterday at 2:42 PM

Excellent, comprehensive, extremely thorough work behind all this. Maturana would love it!

tug2024today at 3:58 AM

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