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When the sun dies, could life survive on the Jupiter ocean moon Europa?

72 pointsby amichaillast Tuesday at 6:56 PM119 commentsview on HN

Comments

kragenlast Tuesday at 9:40 PM

The article claims that Earth will be incinerated, but we could just move Earth further from the Sun. The energy of escape velocity is just GMm/r. r is one AU, 150 gigameters. G is the gravitational constant, 67 piconewton square meters per square kilogram, M is the Sun's mass, 2.0 billion yottagrams. m is the Earth's, 6000 yottagrams. It works out to 5.3 billion yottajoules. The Sun emits 380 yottawatts, thus providing enough energy to move the Earth out of the Solar System entirely every five months. Moving it to a somewhat higher orbit, such as Jupiter's, would require somewhat less energy than that. And we have 500 million years, which most experts consider to be a significantly longer time than five months, so the problem is clearly soluble.

A possible problem is that Jupiter itself could destabilize Earth's new orbit. Possibly putting Earth into orbit around Jupiter as an additional moon would be a solution, but if not, I think we could solve that problem by removing Jupiter. If we drop it into the Sun, we can gain all of its orbital energy in the process.

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hinkleylast Tuesday at 7:42 PM

If we still need to live around Sol when the sun goes red giant, we will have deserved to be selected out of existence.

It would be a shame to abandon her entirely, but don’t count on nostalgia to last for billions of years. We will have empires of people who never lived in Sol who think Good Riddance.

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justforfunherelast Wednesday at 7:38 AM

>> the sun will enter the final phase of its life. Its core of hydrogen fusion will expand and, in doing so, inflate the outer atmosphere of the star into gross proportions. It will swell and become a red giant star that will engulf Mercury and Venus and incinerate Earth.

Does anybody know what is the timescale we are talking about here? From start of inflation of Sun's outer atmosphere to engulfing of earth?

whycomelast Tuesday at 7:58 PM

We will have seeded the life there. And earth will be obliterated. And the emergent intelligent beings will wonder if life can exist somewhere else in the universe. They’ll specifically look for moons around large gas giants orbiting a red giant sun.

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watersblast Tuesday at 8:09 PM

Anywhere there's liquid water, we will find mildew.

A bazillion dollars to explore new worlds, to find this mold that won't come off.

Maybe it will talk to us.

WalterBrightlast Tuesday at 8:24 PM

Radiation on Europa would kill people in a day.

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kruncklast Tuesday at 8:35 PM

Maybe before then a passing star will allow humanity or it's progeny to transfer over to one of the star's orbiting planets?

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MrGutslast Tuesday at 8:30 PM

"When the sun dies, could life survive on the Jupiter ocean moon Europa?"

The answer is yes, of course. Everyone on Europa is going to be fine.

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darkteflonlast Tuesday at 7:22 PM

Of course it’s Europa.

quantadevlast Wednesday at 4:17 AM

Without the sun the only source of energy would be starlight. Planets don't _generate_ energy of their own, they only radiate away energy. So without the sun everything will simply freeze to near absolute zero, once it radiates away all heat energy.

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kwofflast Wednesday at 3:30 AM

There's a paper that suggests that de-oxygenation might happen in around a billion years, so before the sun swallows the earth: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41561-021-00693-5

kaffekakalast Tuesday at 7:36 PM

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