alt Hacker NewsI understand the concerns and anger of GrapheneOS's leadership, but the hyper-escalation tactic doesn't do what they hope:
First, it sends a message of inexperience in business, negotiation, and conflict resolution: 'I'm going to take my ball and leave' - it looks like an emotional overreaction without strategic thinking. These days you sometimes see powerful parties making similar threats - e.g., Uber threatening to leave certain markets. But those people have significant power and their tactic is really to demonstrate that in order to shift their negotiating position; usually they don't actually decamp, and GrapheneOS has relatively little power so that tactic doesn't apply.
As importantly, it sends the message that GrapheneOS can be pushed around and manipulated: A slight hint of a threat and they flee. Others will take note, and many will think the same of other FOSS projects, large and small - they are easily intimidated and dismissed.
Another reason people don't use these tactics is that they have other important interests besides the one under immediate threat. A requirement of anyone with significant investments that can't be easily abandoned - which is everyone doing anything of value - is to navigate in a way that upholds all those interests. You don't burn down the house to kill a rat. It can be hard and requires careful, deliberate thought and strategy.
One unmentioned interest that might appeal to GrapheneOS's leadership is the freedoms of people in France to create FOSS, and to individual privacy and security.
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> it sends the message that GrapheneOS can be pushed around and manipulated: A slight hint of a threat and they flee.
Somehow I doubt France thinks they "won". What they wanted was a back door into the OS. Not only did they not get that but they lost what little bargaining power they had when gOS left France.
> it sends a message of inexperience in business, negotiation
You don't negotiate with terrorists. Obviously France isn't a terror organization but the point is the same: you don't play their game. You play your own.
Leaving the country is exactly that.
I don't know. It's making the news, and if GrapheneOS is the only one protesting this, what are iPhone and Android already complying with? Perhaps I should also switch to GrapheneOS.
And moving your servers out of jurisdictions that threaten them is not hyper-escalation; that's just being responsible.
> self-advertised as uncompromising privacy focused OS
> didn't even compromise even a bit (negotiation is already a compromise) against a country who is notorious for advocating for privacy-invasive policies in recent years
> get lectured by yc high-horse rider on the obligation blah blah, even when by and large this move doesn't materially affect the end-users in any substantial way
I used 4chan style because most of the times 4chan commenters have more sense than yc these days. Many people here do live in glass houses.
I am genuinely not sure you understand what GrapheneOS is doing here. They were using French servers (OVH) for some infrastucture, and they are moving away from that because they are pissed at France.
They don't make GrapheneOS unavailable to French users, they just change "cloud provider".
There is no negotiation or conflict resolution there: they don't feel safe using a French provider, so they move to a non-French provider, period.
Exactly what ball do you think they’re taking and leaving?
Ok, Johanna Brousse
Exiting France when they feel like the freedoms of their software and their contributors are in danger seems like a perfectly reasonable response.
GrapheneOS is an open source project. They hand out great software for free. They have no obligations to do this. And they certainly have no obligation to try to "negotiate" with obviously hostile governments. They have nothing to gain from this.
> You don't burn down the house to kill a rat.
I don't see how this analogy applies here. France is the house.