logoalt Hacker News

ronbentonyesterday at 8:58 PM6 repliesview on HN

I took a transportation engineering class a while back and one bit of knowledge that stuck with me is tolls are the only effective traffic relief mechanisms for a roadway. Other mechanisms like adding lanes just invite more cars and traffic is not relieved. I never checked whether this was true, but sounded reasonable.


Replies

bwhiting2356yesterday at 9:03 PM

Adding lanes may not cut congestion in the long term, but it can increase throughput and overall utility by moving more people and goods.

show 3 replies
kj4211cashtoday at 2:47 PM

Former transportation engineering prof here. This is exactly right. And for many transportation engineers, it's a reason to support toll lanes and to oppose adding (other) lanes. But I agree with some of the other commenters here, that adding lanes supports greater movement of people and goods and, separately, that toll lanes are regressive and come with plenty of (other) issues that are often ignored. My personal take on this is that toll lanes and congestion charging are the most effective methods we know for relieving congestion BUT that they are an incredibly difficult sell politically and maybe for good reason; maybe their issue are worse than the congestion they mitigate.

show 1 reply
throwaway2037today at 6:41 AM

    > Other mechanisms like adding lanes just invite more cars and traffic is not relieved.
I have been seeing this argument for 30 years, and, yet, rich cities in the US (and Canada) continue to add more lanes. My guess: It is just so politically positive to build more lanes that politicians continue to approve them. Why doesn't this happen as much in other rich countries?
throwatdem12311yesterday at 9:09 PM

It’s just supply and demand.

Of course just creating more supply when the cost to the consumer is basically 0 will just juice the demand to fit the new capacity. Tale as old as time.

MangoToupeyesterday at 9:43 PM

Have you considered fuel rationing?

expedition32yesterday at 9:04 PM

But you run into the risk that people don't use your new expensive toll road and you're left with a big pile of debt...

That is the problem with them in the Netherlands. Building and maintaining roads is so frighteningly expensive that you can't price them to even cover the cost!

show 2 replies