alt Hacker NewsYes, the web was a mistake; as a distributed document reading platform it's a decent first attempt, but as an application platform it is miserable. I'm working on a colleague's vibe-coded app right now and it's just piles and piles of code to do something fairly simple; long builds and hundreds of dependencies... most of which are because HTML is shitty, doesn't have the GUI controls that people need built in, and all of it has to be worked around as a patch after the fact. Even doing something as simple as a sortable-and-filterable table requires thousands of lines of JS when it should've just been a few extra attributes on an HTML6 <table> by now.
Back in the day with PHP things were much more understandable, it's somehow gotten objectively worse. And now, most desktop apps are their own contained browser. Somehow worse than Windows 98 .hta apps, too; where at least the system browser served a local app up, now we have ten copies of Electron running, bringing my relatively new Macbook to a crawl. Everything sucks and is way less fun than it used to be.
We have many, many examples of GUI toolkits that are extremely fast and lightweight. Isn't it time to throw the browser away, stop abusing HTML to make applications, and design something fit for purpose?
Replies
> Isn't it time to throw the browser away, stop abusing HTML to make applications, and design something fit for purpose?
Great. How do you get all the hardware and OS vendors to deploy it for free and without applying their own "vetting" or inserting themselves into the billing?
> Isn't it time to throw the browser away, stop abusing HTML to make applications, and design something fit for purpose?
We had Flash for exactly that purpose. For all its flaws, it was our best hope. A shame Apple and later Adobe decided to kill it in favor of HTML5.
The second best bet was Java Applets, but the technology came too early and was dead before it could fly off.
Some may mention WebAssembly, but I just don't see that as a viable alternative to the web mess that we already have.
> sortable-and-filterable table
Just use jquery and this plugin, 7kB minified:
https://github.com/myspace-nu/jquery.fancyTable/blob/master/...
Nah, some fixes to HTML would go a long way to address these issues.
I agree we need in built-in controls, reasonably sophisticated, properly style-able with CSS. We also need typed JS in the browser, etc
the web is great as an application platform.
what's not great are the complexity merchants, due to money & other incentives etc that ship to the web.
there's better web frameworks that are lighter, faster than react - but due to hype etc you know how that goes
> the web was a mistake;
It's not "the web" or HTML, CSS, or JavaScript. That's all instant in vanilla form. Any media in today's quality will of course take time to download but, once cached, is also instant. None of the UX "requires" the crap that makes it slow, certainly not thousands of lines to make a table sortable and filterable. I could do that in IE6 without breaking a sweat. It's way easier, and faster, now. It's just people being lazy in how they do it, Apparetnly now just accepting whatever claude gave them as "best in show".
Back in PHP days you had an incentive to care about performance, because it's your servers that are overloaded. With frontend there's no such issue, because it's not your hardware that is being loaded
> Isn't it time to throw the browser away, stop abusing HTML to make applications, and design something fit for purpose?
Not going to happen until gui frameworks are as comfortable and easy to set up and use as html. Entry barrier and ergonomics are among the biggest deciding factors of winning technologies.