Logseq 2.0 Beta (DB version) is here

It pains me to say, but it's probably too little, too late. Logseq remained a buggy mess, is now on an unmaintained (thus insecure) version of electron.

And now after several years of complete stagnation, the supposed improvement is a database format to fix their technical issues, so I can no longer keep all my data as markdown files? At a time when half the edits are done by Claude and tracked with jujustu, this is just not useful for me.

All I wanted was the original vision, but with less bugs and more quality of life features.

I'm sympathetic to Logseq here. My guess is that many things are true but do not sum attractively to an audience right now.

The db probably is the cleaner place for Logseq's note storage, but invites comparison to Obsidian, whose fundamental unit of information is already a document, where Logseq's is more like a bulletpoint. Logseq being open source where Obsidian isn't could maybe blunt the edge of moving to a less-portable format, but a user can also understandably look at the status of two-way sync and see an unsexy "In-progress" and figure that's not good enough. Logseq also carries some baggage wrt instability, and the argument that the db is the pro-stability move unfortunately needs to be proven over time. Overall seems like a rough spot to be in.

I dunno. I like Logseq and wish them a good launch.

I've been using Logseq DB (this new version, as a nightly, for a year) and it's a really great concept, way better than anything I tried for notes and organisation. You can apply tags to blocks, which make them a kind of thing (a project, an author, a quote, a thought). It is very fast, and easy to learn.

I switched to it from Apple Notes + Obsidian (I've used logseq MD in the distant past). I have to say though that there are still some rough edges in the current developments and many concepts are still half-baked (Assets, Library).

I still use it because with it, I take more notes and retrieve them better, which is really convenient. The barrier to jotting something down is very low. I think the dev have really hit a sweet spot so I hope they can polish this application as it should be.

Any good outliner alternatives out there?

I originally came from Roam and was really happy to find an offline alternative in Logseq. I've since moved to Obsidian, though. Obsidian works well, but I still feel like my brain works best with the outliner-style workflow that Roam and Logseq offer.

I have heard of https://outl.app/ but when I tried it out, it still seemed in a very early stage (and heavily vibe-coded, which I also don't enjoy).

I really dislike this style of development: abandon the current version and start a perpetual beta that you're expected to use as your daily driver, as that's the only version that's also getting updated and QoL improvements. If you stay on the older version, expect breaking changes when/if they release a non-beta version, and have bugs unfixed. Or expect bugs/breaking changes if you use the perpetual beta and perhaps some of the previous bugs fixed (see: finamp, linksheet, and lawnchair, as a few examples). Applications that follow this development model are hard to recommend.

Despite enjoying logseq a lot it has stagnated for so long (and the mobile app is atrocious) that I ended up moving to obsidian. It was frustrating to see "new" versions get updates, bug fixes, and QoL improvements that I couldn't use unless I was willing to run an unstable build (plus they didn't update the mobile app during the beta, so it felt half-baked anyway). Even now, it's still a beta. Its such a shame.

Funny because a couple weeks ago a colleague showed me his Obsidian based note taking for work, and I decided to start trying that and Logseq out, side to side, learning their ins and outs as replacement of Keep for Android note taking.

So far I liked them both, Logseq is quirkier but I can live with quirky in FOSS. Confusingly enough though, now a new rework is announced and switching away from Markdown... One improvement I want from Keep is to have notes synced to my Linux PC and grep over them, so this news make the decision easier I guess.

For the people commenting on the inability of using LLMs for managing their graphs due to the more away from markdown files, the DB version comes with a fully-fledged CLI bundled with the desktop app that can be used to interact with the logseq graph using Claude code or codex

Well. Time to look for a new editor again. Ain't no way I'm giving up my dumb file syncing that works for decades.

Maybe this time I'll find one with a sane extension system, so it isn't open-season for malware.

After Logseq moved to an app focus and abandoned the "edit anywhere" convenience of being browser-based, I lost interest. I liked the original Logseq/Roam/Athens model, and I couldn't find anything similar elsewhere, so I just wrote my own. Markdown, git for versions, remote backup, themes (using the Tinted Themes repository of base16 themes), optionally encrypted notes. Lives in a browser, editable from anything with a browser and an Internet connection. Absolute note-taking heaven (for me). No more fooling with sync solutions or not being able to install an app on certain devices.

I'm sorry to have said goodbye to what used to be a great community project, but they've been following the classic enshittification model, albeit slowly, for a while now.

I donated $15/month for from mid-2022 to early-2023 to try Logseq Sync when it was in beta. I thought I'd support them while they got it over the finishline then pay for the feature. It's still in beta. What a joke.

I am still on a very old version of logseq. Why update?

Logseq is a mystery to me. They used to have a web version that they discontinued to "concentrate on the product", and that's where they lost me. I assume they "concentrated" on the app and the desktop version, presumably to get some revenue from their sync service, which is understandable, but it could have been executed better. Fast forward a couple of years and I see they're incomprehensibly pivoting to split the product in two. If it's strategy, I can't understand it.

The writing is on the wall for PKMSs the moment LLMs are powerful enough to drive agentic workflows.

No mention of a migration guide from V1 to V2, even in the "Big Update" post? What the heck