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EugeneGtoday at 1:40 PM6 repliesview on HN

Honest question: what are the actual concrete issues where Amazon is shirking responsibility they would have otherwise had? Was there a specific court case where Amazon didn't pay what it would have otherwise? A workplace injury that would have been covered but otherwise wasn't? If these exist, are they systemic - i.e., does it happen more often here than it does with UPS or FedEx delivery workers?

There are insinuations here, and a good video, but it would be good to have actual examples and then an actual demonstration of a pattern of harm, before we introduce new rules that are likely going to make deliveries more expensive.

I understand that a YouTube video isn't a policy document... and I don't expect it to have all of these things. But as a citizen, I do expect - that somewhere - there should be an actual policy document that outlines the facts.


Replies

stackskiptontoday at 1:57 PM

Here is the problem, Amazon is not actually driving most of "Amazon" trucks you see the on the road. They are likely being driven and owned by "Joes Delivery Company LLC". If you look at the bottom of the truck, you will generally see the ACTUAL owner name. So if anything happens to worker or public is harmed, Joes Delivery Company is cutout fall person. So if worker or public sues or fined, the company folds, the assets sold off to Joes Delivery Company, the part deus" and it starts all over again.

This act is basically saying "Nope, we are considering them Amazon employees, so we can sue or fine Amazon for their actions regardless of name on employees paycheck or car registered owner." Also, if they combined into single company, it makes union actions much easier.

This happens with FedEx/UPS as well.

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runakotoday at 1:58 PM

The bill[1], which is named in the video, is available on the public Internet.

1 - https://legistar.council.nyc.gov/LegislationDetail.aspx?ID=7...

chiitoday at 1:53 PM

The people making propaganda (and yes, this is propaganda) knows that people are not rational but emotional. The video targets emotions - that amazon shirks responsibility is an emotional appeal.

The hidden assumption is that there is some sort of responsibility that amazon ought to have, and that by shirking it, they're doing you harm. Instead of facts, they're listing things that give viewer a bad gut reaction like injury and accidents. The idea is already baked into the premise of the video, rather than propose a neutral question to the viewer; ala, at what level are a client responsible for the contractor's health and wellbeing. Why don't they ask this for tradies and plumbers?

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FatherOfCursestoday at 1:57 PM

Are you saying that there is a lack of easily accessible information about how Amazon drivers are overworked compared to UPS/Fedex drivers?

Xirdustoday at 1:49 PM

The actual problem is not that Amazon breaks any rules, but that the rules are so soft that even Amazon doesn't break them. But explaining it to an average worker doesn't work. Blaming specific companies and specific billionaires for systemic problems works much better for building support - that's why the politician in the video does the latter.

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philipallstartoday at 1:48 PM

I think you're asking the wrong questions of someone like this. The point is to get power, to make sure you are well looked after. Give him more power to make your life better.