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roughlytoday at 4:30 PM7 repliesview on HN

The other rule here is that you cannot avoid politics if you want to create a better world. If you want the freedom to develop technology without worrying it will be used by a police state, you need to put in the work to make sure a police state doesn't happen - you cannot ignore politics and just "focus on technology."


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__MatrixMan__today at 4:46 PM

On the other hand, a few heuristics will get you pretty far:

Don't build technology that interacts with people in ways they did't consent to. Don't build skinner boxes. Let the user decide who gets whatever data they generate while using the thing. Let the user control how it will work, insofar as it doesn't contradict the other heuristics.

These are political principles, but they're pretty basic. You don't have to keep up to date with the news, just check in with your morals once in a while.

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bkotoday at 4:47 PM

How do you make sure a police state doesn't happen? Block traffic? Tweet? Cut off ties with friends and family that don't share your political beliefs?

Of course you can avoid politics. Just be a good person. Vote for who you think is the best candidate at the time. And move on with your life.

Ironically the people most involved in politics don't have their own house in order. They're often mentally ill, over educated, underemployed and without meaningful ties in their life (e.g. family, real life community, etc).

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tshaddoxtoday at 5:21 PM

Politics in the broadest sense is just any decision-making process where a single decision affects multiple people and those people don't all agree on which decision should be made.

pannytoday at 5:14 PM

>you cannot ignore politics and just "focus on technology."

Stallman was right again

https://www.azquotes.com/quote/755239

TZubiritoday at 5:16 PM

An conscientious objection is definitely a right you have as a professional, but it's a neutral action, you refuse to do something, and you let someone else do it. If you really are against it, you actively do something about it, like presenting a law or making a criminal complaint.

That said, they are both compatible, you can refuse to do something, and make efforts so that nobody does it.

But I think the the latter is the actual core security model of our society, and refusals aren't really effective to the point that I wouldn't worry much about it and just focus on compartimentalizing and executing on my duties. Isn't it theoretically possible that upper management divides duties so that engineers cannot accurately judge the ethical correctness of the task and the overall mission? As an individual you don't have the right tools to make such an evaluation. You can be pushed to investigate further, but the moment you do so, you cease your role as an engineer and put your citizen hat on.

I personally wouldn't object on most cases, my threshold would be very high, a database of people's sexuality is not even close to even being concerning to me, that's like a Wikipedia infobox property. But even if it were a feature that did concern me, like a citizen-ID to real time coordinates system, I wanna be at the helm of it, either way (if I get the privilege). If something is wrong, I'd be in a privileged position to do something about it internally, judicially or through congress, there's also whistleblowing if it comes to that, but that's not in me.

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IncreasePoststoday at 5:11 PM

Actually, you cannot avoid sex. Everything is about sex, even politics. If you want the freedom to develop technology without worrying it will be used by a police state, you cannot ignore sex and just "focus on technology"

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apitoday at 4:37 PM

There's a deep failed idea here. It's the idea that technology is an alternative to politics, period. I think that whole idea has failed.

You can't avoid building technologies that could be used by a police state, because literally everything can be used for warfare or aggression. The first person who sharpened a stick or a rock created a weapon. Everything is a weapon. Everything is dual-use.

If you want to prevent a police state or any other undesirable political outcome, you have to confront the politics directly. "Change the tools and you change the rules," an old saying from 1990s cyber-culture, is an idea that I think has failed. Instead what happens is that the rules determine what's done with the tools. Those 90s cyber-hippie and cyber-libertarian types vastly underestimated the power of the political to the point of making a category error.

Cryptocurrency is a great case in point. It started as an attempt to create a technology that would act as an escape hatch from corrupt casino capitalism and state-backed financialization. Instead it became an insane absurdist parody of those things. The same types of corrupt individuals who profited off "too big to fail" and the rest of it simply took cryptocurrency and used it to implement the same type of system but on a block chain. The rules (and rulers) changed the tools, not the other way around.

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