No argument there, but it doesn't change the fact that some people, properly motivated, with the right backgrounds and right tasks, do get plenty of lift with these tools.

Note that I specifically mentioned that I'm skeptical of claims of insane lift in workplace contexts. Several factors work against it there, organizational dysfunction not least of all, not to mention a disconnect between the people doing the work and the people for whom the work has value. People being crunched by their boss to ship some corporate portal software faster are going to make shit. You making something for yourself, to solve your own problem to your own satisfaction, needing to clear problems outside but adjacent to your proficiencies, should be able to do much better. Many people have found it to be so.