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cmontella • today at 6:38 PM • 3 replies • view on HN

I remember Steve from my days working on Eve, he was part of that community and always a big proponent of end-user programming. I was happy to see him working on this project but am not surprised it's shutting down.

Nothing to to do with the quality of Val Town, but making a business in this space is really, really hard. You can't start the business without raising millions (Eve raised $2M, Darklang raised $3.5M, Val Town raised $7M), but it's hard to scale out a proof of concept in the time investors want to start seeing an ROI. It seems to me about 2-3 years is all you get for seed runway, when realistically projects like this should take at minimum 5 years incubating. Darklang extended their runway to ~7-8 years by firing all the devs and keeping just the founder on life support. Ultimately even that wasn't enough.

But maybe with AI this could work, I dunno.

What's required to make it all work is a fundamental leap in programming interface design, but the business side doesn't look any different from a typical SaaS. So unless you hit the ball out of the park you're entering the market with an experimental product, then you have to deal with product-market fit even if you have the right product, so you really only have one shot.

It's very hard to go back to investors and ask for another round of funding when there's no discernable market and the product isn't gaining the traction investors would like to see.

Anyway, kudos to Steve for fighting the good fight! What would really be great is to read an in-depth post mortem on the project. Looking forward to it if you have time!


Replies

swyx • today at 7:48 PM

> It seems to me about 2-3 years is all you get for seed runway, when realistically projects like this should take at minimum 5 years incubating.

measuring things by years is not really first principles thinking. i think the reality is that end user programming looks a lot more like notion than it is like valtown.

drekipus • today at 7:01 PM

Why bother with investing, why not just build it small and sustainable to begin with?

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necrodome • today at 7:33 PM

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