alt Hacker NewsStargate Project: SoftBank, OpenAI, Oracle, MGX to build data centers
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This is so much money with which we could actually solve problems in the world. maybe even stop wars which break out because of scarcity issues.
maybe i am getting to old or to friendly to humans, but it's staggering to me how the priorities are for such things.
You have to keep in mind Microsoft is planning on spending almost 100B in datacenter capex this year and they're not alone. This is basically OpenAI matching the major cloud provider's spending.
This could also be (at least partly) a reaction to Microsoft threatening to pull OpenAI's cloud credits last year. OpenAI wants to maintain independence and with compute accounting for 25–50% of their expenses (currently) [2], this strategy may actually be prudent.
[1] https://www.cnbc.com/2025/01/03/microsoft-expects-to-spend-8...
I'm confused and a bit disturbed; honestly having a very difficult time internalizing and processing this information. This announcement is making me wonder if I'm poorly calibrated on the current progress of AI development and the potential path forward. Is the key idea here that current AI development has figured out enough to brute force a path towards AGI? Or I guess the alternative is that they expect to figure it out in the next 4 years...
I don't know how to make sense of this level of investment. I feel that I lack the proper conceptual framework to make sense of the purchasing power of half a trillion USD in this context.
~$125B per year would be 2-3% of all domestic investment. It's similar in scale to the GDP of a small middle income country.
If the electric grid — particularly the interconnection queue — is already the bottleneck to data center deployment, is something on this scale even close to possible? If it's a rationalized policy framework (big if!), I would guess there's some major permitting reform announcement coming soon.
For fun, I calculated how this stacks up against other humanity-scale mega projects.
Mega Project Rankings (USD Inflation Adjusted)
The New Deal: $1T,
Interstate Highway System: $618B,
OpenAI Stargate: $500B,
The Apollo Project: $278B,
International Space Station: $180B,
South-North Water Transfer: $106B,
The Channel Tunnel: $31B,
Manhattan Project: $30B
Insane Stuff.
Apart from my general queasiness about the whole AGI scaling business and the power concentration that comes with it, these are the exact four people/entities that I would not want to be at the tip of said power concentration.
Where are they getting the $500B? Softbank's market cap is 84b and their entire vision fund is only $100b, Oracle only has $11b cash on hand, OpenAI's only raised $17b total...
The moon program was $318 billion in 2023 dollars, this one is $500 billion. So that's why the tech barons who were present at the inauguration were high as a kite yesterday, they just got the financing for a real moon shot!
I miss n gate so much. I asked AI to generate one for this thread.
"In a stunning display of fiscal restraint, Sam Altman only asks for $500 billion instead of his previous $7 trillion moonshot. Hackernews rejoices that the money will be spent in Texas, where the power grid is as stable as a cryptocurrency exchange. Oracle's involvement prompts lengthy discussions about whether Larry Ellison's surveillance dystopia will run on Java or if they'll need to purchase an enterprise license for consciousness itself. Meanwhile, SoftBank's Masayoshi Son continues his streak of funding increasingly expensive ways to turn electricity into promises, this time with added patriotism. The comments section devolves into a heated debate about whether this is technically fascism or just regular old corporatocracy, with several users helpfully pointing out that actually, the real problem is systemd."
The US appears to be fully in the grips of centralized economic autarky. A tiny coterie of industrialists who have the President's ear decide how to allocate a gigantic amount of capital for their pet projects while the state raises tariffs and implements bans to protect them from competition.
Didn't go well for South America in the 60s and 70s but perhaps, as economists are prone to saying, "this time will be different".
It appears this basically locks out Google, Amazon and Meta. Why are we declaring OpenAI as the winner? This is like declaring Netscape the winner before the dust settled. Having the govt involved in this manner can’t be a good thing.
I hear this joked about sometimes or used as a metaphor, but in the literal sense of the phrase, are we in a cold war right now? These types of dollars feel "defense-y", if that makes sense. Especially with the big focus on energy, whatever that ends up meaning. Defense as a motivation can get a lot done very fast so it will be interesting to watch, though it raises the hair on my arms
Tangential, but this has gotten me thinking...
I used to wonder how the hundreds of thousands of employees that work in Big Oil or Big Pharma could tolerate all the terrible things their company does... e.g. the opioid epidemic. The naive optimist in me never thought that the tech industry would ever be that bad.
Now, as someone thats been in the industry for 10+ years and working adjacent to LLMs, this is all so depressing. The hype has gotten out of control. We are spending hundreds of billions of dollars on things that simply are not making life better for the majority of people.
Any clues to how they plan to invest $500 billion dollars? What infrastructure are they planning that will cost that much?
"create hundreds of thousands of American jobs"... Given the current educational system in the US, this should be fun to watch. Oh yeah, Musk and his H-1B Visa thing. Now it's making sense.
After they build the Multivac or Deep Thought, or whatever it is they’re trying to do, then what happens? It makes all the stockholders a lot of money?
I really don't understand the national security argument. If you really do fear some fundamental breakthrough in AI from China, what's cheaper, $500 billion to rush to get there first, or spending a few billion (and likely much less) in basic research in physics, materials science, and electronics, mixed with a little bit of espionage, mixed with improving the electric grid and eliminating (or greatly reducing) fossil fuels?
Ultimately, the breakthrough in AI is going to either come from eliminating bottlenecks in computing such that we can simulate many more neurons much more cheaply (in other words, 2025-level technology scaled up is not going to really be necessary or sufficient), or some fundamental research discovery such as a new transformer paradigm. In any case, it feels like these are theoretical discoveries that, whoever makes them first, the other "side" can trivially steal or absorb the information.
Leopold Aschenbrenner predicted it last June.
https://situational-awareness.ai/racing-to-the-trillion-doll...
The biggest question on such investment from my POV, is what do the Deepseek results mean about the usefulness/efficiency of this investment?
I've been meaning to read a relevant book to today's times called Engines That Move Markets. Will probably get it from the library.
There's a good amount of irony in the results that AI have achieved, particularly if we reach AGI - they have improved individual worker efficiency by removing other workers from the system. Naming it Stargate implies a reckoning with the actual series itself - an accomplishment by humanity. Instead, what this pushes, is accomplishing the removal of humans from humanity. I like cool shiny tech, but I like useful tech that really helps humans more. Work on 3D-printing sustainable food, or something actually useful like that. Jenson doesn't need another 1B gallons of water under his belt.
March 2024: The Stargate project is announced - https://www.tomshardware.com/tech-industry/artificial-intell...
June 2024: Oracle joins in - https://www.datacenterdynamics.com/en/news/openai-to-use-oci...
January 2025: Softbank provides additional funding, and they for some reason give credit to Trump?
Last year, sama goal was 5 to 7T. Now he is going with 100B, with option for another 400B. Huge numbers, but it still feels like a bit of a down turn.
Who/what is MGX? Google returns a few hits, none of which are clearly who is referred to here.
Can't wait for these to succeed just in time for them to tell us
'you should have spent all this time and money fighting climate change'
Why is Larry Ellison giving a speech about the power of AI to cure disease? How is Oracle relevant at all to any of AI progress in the past few years?
The fact that they plan to start in Texas makes me think that the whole thing is just the biggest pork barrel of all times.
SoftBank isn't a US entity, right? Aside from their risk tolerance, that seems like an odd bedfellow for a national US initiative...
How likely is success when 4 or more other massive companies work together on a project? Seems like a lot of chefs in the kitchen..
If I understand correctly - if you are training a model to perform a particular task - in the end what matters is the training data - and by and large different models will largely converge on the best representation of that data for the given task, given enough compute.
So that means the models themselves aren't really IP - they are inevitable outputs from optimising using the input data for a certain task.
I think this means pretty much everyone, apart from the AI companies - will see these models as pre-competitive.
Why spend huge amounts training the same model multiple times, when you can collaborate?
Note it only takes one person/company/country to release an open source model for a particular task to nuke the business model of those companies that have a business model of hoarding them.
I saw Stargate trending on Bluesky and got my hopes up about an announcement of a new show/movie/something. Disappointing.
It seems early for this sort of move. This is also a huge spin on the whole thing that could throw a lot of people off.
Is there any planned future partnerships? Stargate implies something about movies and astronomy. Movies in particular have a lot of military influence, but not always.
So, what's the play? Help mankind or go after mankind?
Also, can I opt-out right now?
What a waste of a great name. Why form a separate company for this?
> The buildout is currently underway, starting in Texas, and we are evaluating potential sites across the country for more campuses as we finalize definitive agreements.
For those interested, it looks like Albany, NY (upstate NY) is very likely one of the next growth sites.
[0] https://www.schumer.senate.gov/newsroom/press-releases/schum...
Can someone convince me Sam Altman is not evil? I have no proof he is not evil.
So about 10% of what Sam was asking the Saudis (and everyone else) for a year ago? That's still a helluva lot of money.
Interesting that the UAE (MGX) and Japan (Softbank) are bankrolling the re-industrialization of America.
Was Skynet project already taken? Wonder how many public infrastructure or resource programs will be cut to fund this.
How much exaFLOPS can we expect from a 100 Billions dollars datacenter today? A rough estimate from a quick Perplexity search gives us 24 exaFLOPS for all smartphones in the world and 12 exaFLOPS for personal computers. Could a competitor to such a Datacenter be a collective effort with some sort of crypto to split the benefits?
Can we build a wall to keep AI out?
I read the announcement and the first three words that came to my mind were...
"Hammond, of Texas"
(apologies to those who haven't watched SG-1)
"SoftBank, OpenAI, Oracle, and MGX" seems like quite the lineup. Two groups who are good at frivolously throwing away investment money because they have so much capital to deploy, there really isn't anything reasonable to do with it, a tech "has-been" and OpenAI. You become who you surround yourself with I guess.
This here reminds me a bubble in the making. Like South Sea Bubble to be precise.
In America!
The intro paragraph in the original URL https://openai.com/index/announcing-the-stargate-project/ mentions US/America for 5 times!
> The new entity, Stargate, will start building out data centers and the electricity generation needed for the further development of the fast-evolving AI in Texas, according to the White House.
Wouldn't a more northern state be a better location given the average temperatures of the environment? I've heard Texas is hot!
> All three credited Trump for helping to make the project possible, even though building has already started and the project goes back to 2024.
It’s sad to see the president of US being ass kissed so much by these guys. I always assumed there’s a little of that but this is another extreme. If this is true, I fear America has become like a third world country with a dictator like head of state where everyone just praises him and get favors in return.
I'm in the middle of "Devil Take the Hindmost: A History of Financial Speculation" and hoo boy, there are strong deja vu vibes here.
Just waiting for the current regime to decide that we should go all-in on some big AI venture and bet the whole Social Security pot on it.
No amount of money invested in infrastructure is going to solve the "garbage in, garbage out" problem with AI, and it looks like the AI companies have already stolen the vast majority of content that is possible to steal. So this is basically a massive gamble that some innovation is going to make AI do something better than faultily regurgitate its training data. I'm not seeing a corresponding investment which actually attempts to solve the "garbage in, garbage out" problem.
A fraction of this money invested in building homes would end the homelessness problem in the U.S.
I guess the one silver lining here is that when the likely collapse happens, we'll have more clean energy infrastructure to use for more useful things.
Why are we spending a half-trillion dollars on “AI infrastructure” when our actual infrastructure has been crumbling and underfunded for decades?
Sad waste of money that will go in Oracle licenses... The lost liberties of the American people is just a small feat... beside the point
We changed the URL from https://openai.com/index/announcing-the-stargate-project/ to a third-party report. Readers may want to read both. If there's a better URL, we can change it again.