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BobbyJoyesterday at 6:25 AM4 repliesview on HN

This ignores the other financial and non-financial costs of offshoring: legal, cultural, temporal... a lot of the time, those close the gap.

On paper, offshoring has made sense the entire time, and yet here we are in 2025 and companies still hire American devs. Not only that, they often fly in foreign devs just to pay them more here than if they had just offshored to their home country.


Replies

xliiyesterday at 7:20 AM

I have approx. 15 years of experience working remotely for various companies all across the globe and was always an advocate of thesis that remote work is difficult and most people aren’t cut for it and (to horror of many proponents) and on average are less efficient than on-site hires.

There are many reasons: It’s difficult to understand _intention_ when deprived of non-verbal communication and working in a choppy network call. Even if one can gloss over communication needs etc. there’s burnout looming around the corner and natural, healthy laziness getting into the way. Sometimes even internal politics might be blocking knowledge/access/contribution for more or less peculiar reasons.

It’s not like it’s impossible to hire remote engineer, yet my (completely unmetered) estimates out of experience is that approx. 10% of engineers willing to work remotely can sustain health (physical and mental) and be efficient outside of 1-2 years of honeymoon period.

There was some tumbling around COVID but IMO both stationary jobs and remote ones are doing well on mid-high quality positions.

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cbg0yesterday at 8:37 AM

It also has to do with how the companies handle the offshoring, as some larger corporations take the approach of just using an outsourcing company from a specific country (usually chosen by price) and assume that you can just pay a specific amount of money per developer and they will all be the same quality as the guys coming into the office.

I've worked most of my career as a remote employee and I can say that the best arrangement is when the company is as involved in hiring offshore employees as they are with hiring onshore ones. Someone working through an intermediary will always be disconnected from the company's success, as they work for an outsourcing company, and not the US corporation itself.

There are definitely a lot of discussions to be had around employee cultural fit, and I don't just mean company culture. You want a similar mindset and work ethic that your other employees have if you want a high chance of success.

We also need to talk about how some companies haven't been able to successfully adapt their processes to work with remote employees alongside the office employees and sometimes treat the offshore ones as second class citizens, which is not really a great thing.

__loamyesterday at 6:31 AM

Yeah people have been offshoring then onshoring once they realize offshoring sucks since at least the 90s. I remember my dad, who was also a software dev, complaining about it 20 years ago. It always swings back. The network effect in huge hubs like SF and NYC is massive.

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AnthonyMouseyesterday at 8:29 AM

In addition to this, those factors contribute varying amounts to the total in any given case. So you also can't make the case that offshoring never makes sense, because in specific cases it does. But now there is a ~20% incentive for it to make sense in fewer cases.