alt Hacker NewsLG ThinQ Terms of Use
Some of my kitchen appliances are LG and I installed the LG ThinQ app on my phone.
Sometimes I like to leave a cold dish in the oven before I go out then remotely start it when I’m on my way back home, so I arrive to a nice hot dinner.
After a recent HN post about LG malware and further research, I decided to kick my appliances out of the network.
I also tried to remove my user account just to find out that in order to use the app I need to first accept the new terms of use.
I asked ChatGPT for a summary. This seems a lot more aggressive than the standard terms of use of other products and services.
1. No arbitration opt-out. You give up court, jury trial, class actions, mass actions, and collective claims. Most disputes must go through individual arbitration, and LG says your only alternative is to stop using the service. Claims generally must be brought within one year. (Sections 20.b and 20.c)
2. Broad rights over anything you submit. LG receives a perpetual, irrevocable, transferable, worldwide licence to use, modify, sublicense, and commercially exploit your user content “for any purpose whatsoever,” without payment. Avoid uploading photos, recordings, documents, or detailed personal information. (Section 9.b)
3. No privacy expectation for communications. LG states that it may monitor user content and that you have no expectation of privacy for in-app chat, text, or voice communications. (Section 9.e)
4. Voice capture can include other people. Voice-enabled products may record and analyse family members, children, guests, and bystanders. LG places responsibility on you to inform them and obtain any legally required consent. (Section 4.d)
5. AI may use appliance and usage data. LG says third-party AI systems may rely on data from your use of its products and services. The terms do not clearly describe exactly what is transmitted, how long it is retained, or whether it is used to improve models. That information should be in the separate privacy policy. (Section 4.a)
6. Marketing consent is bundled into use. By using the service, you agree to email, texts, calls, automated or prerecorded messages, and push notifications, including promotions. You can opt out, but you must do so separately. (Section 5)
7. Targeted advertising is permitted. LG reserves the right to show targeted third-party advertising based on user preferences. (Section 11.b)
8. Very low liability limit. For many claims, LG attempts to cap its liability at the greater of the amount involved in the transaction, $100, or a statutory remedy. It also broadly excludes responsibility for lost data and unauthorized access. Local law may limit these clauses. (Section 17)
9. LG can update services remotely. It may push over-the-air updates without further consent and can change or discontinue features. (Sections 3.c and 18)
Comments
Quick fix, remove networking access for all devices, not just LG devices.
But since you did that remotely, you probably do that from a "smart" phone. That one is worst than this LG device.
Have you read terms of service of Android devices? Windows? Apple?
Microsoft like Gamers Nexus show on the video, writes down that this practices are malware and illegal and does exact the same thing.
Gamers Nexus amazing review of that LG https://youtu.be/Q9uefFYe6bM
Thank you for reminding me to disable Wi-Fi network in my LG tv. I was planning to do it recently but forgot. I really don't need those WebOS updates to the TV I use with decoder and Google TV dongle
Their support is also absolutely awful.
I had one of their washing machines. Purchased about 18 months ago. The dispenser drawer broke. I'm pretty sure it was bad out of the factory but it did last for this long, so I was happy to shell out for a new one.
Turns out they don't exist. LG have a website where you can search for the part. It's not in stock. They told me to fill out a form on a website they own, giving the part number. A third-party spare parts shop emailed me back saying they don't have the part in stock and that I should contact the manufacturer.
I found one that may or may not be the correct one and there's no way to know for sure before purchasing it. It costs almost £100 and takes 3 weeks to ship.
After days of this ordeal and laundry piling up, I decided to cut my losses and buy a Bosch. That one seems pretty great so far.
As enshittification continues to accelerate, terms of service/ privacy policies are going from comically draconian to completely insane attempts to preempt both consumer rights and common sense.
For now at least, we can still find the last few “dumb” models that simply function at appliances without all the bloatware, but that’s little solace. In another ten years, I suspect we may be left with little option but to refurbish old (proprietary!) appliances as best we can.
Maybe this is wishful thinking, but there ought to be a market opening for simple, durable, easily repairable appliances? Where is the competition?
How much is some AI SaaS company or some AI training company paying for this type of data? It has to be a lot for them to risk doing something like this.
LG Appliances are garbage I would never buy one.
Don't ever give a "device" network access. Unfortunately with stuff like amazon sidewalk -- even that's not sufficient, products can contain covert listening/watching devices and then share the information over a network you don't control.
A countermeasure to this is to maintain a radio quiet household, but it's only doable if you're out in the middle of nowhere and requires some substantial confessions as MANY devices have 2.4ghz radios in them.
Someone should sue their friend for inviting them over and not giving them a GDPR notice. This will finally make LG far too radioactive to buy.
I've given up on LG and Samsung appliances. This includes TVs, all electronics too. They are simply the worst products to live with. They break frequently, hard to find parts for, even harder to fix if you even manage to find the part. They're designed by AI or something, I've never encountered such hostile engineering. They are never intended to be fixed, hidden fasteners, one time use tabs made from some of the lowest quality plastic. Oddly enough, the cheapest GE appliances are made to be fixed seemingly. Parts are readily accessible, they're super easy to repair.
But it's the end of korean electronics and appliances, and this extends to cars too, Kia and Hyundai designs are near the bottom in terms of repairability.